Thanks and a tip of the hat go out to Bob. The reason your seeing all the blackhawk bucket ships is because you can buy a milsurp bird for less than 2$ million and be flying on a fire for less than 5. DOI Incident Position Qualification Guide (IPQG) AABI. No wonder there is absolutely no concern about the financial impact of this proposal. 2. For type 3 helos it may be possible, providing the USFS can double the budget because thats what vendors are going to bid for a new aircraft with higher maintenance cost and complexity, additionally operating hot and high im sure the load charts are going to have to be quite conservative to ensure OEI is landing safely and not just crashing slower, Everything has to be in balance, you cant spend unlimited money, and you cant eliminate all risk, the safest and most inexpensive helicopter is one that sits on the ground. NWCG typing standards enable accurate ordering and acquisition of needed resources in support of nationally interoperable wildland fire operations. Contractor Performance Assessment Reporting System (CPARS) Focal Point, Mike McFarlane,Contracting Officer Normally both are higher with a CWN. In reality the CWN is the same, many times EU ships roll into a day by day CWN extension of their EU contract after the mandatory availability period is over if there are still fires. What will replace a 407 for a Type III ship? Fax: (208) 387-5384, https://www.fs.usda.gov/managing-land/fire/contracting, Important Information Regarding the COVID-19 Pandemic, Access to the U.S. Forest Service Contracting, Incident Support Branch, DOI SharePoint Page must be granted individually. The Incident Command System (ICS) uses this system based on the equipment capability. They ensure the impressive attack on flames with water. Montana / Dakotas Fire and Aviation, NRCC The U.S. Forest Service has awarded 90-day contracts for an 22 additional helicopters that can lift at least 3,300 or 7,000 pounds. Aviation for Region 2 Unmanned Aerial Supervision(UAS) Program, Delphine Arizana, Contract Specialist Bill do you have access to USFS decision makers? They claim that 2 times throughout the 1/9 year parent contract, they will allow onboarding of new vendors/equipment. As I indicated, Im very interested in more reporting on this from the customer side of the table, IE the USFS as well as industry. Office: (208) 387-5272 Mobile: (208) 616-5546 National Air Attack Exclusive Use Aircraft Thank you. All the UTFs for rotors can get name-tied back to a few individuals at NIFC. The user of this information is responsible for confirming they have the most up-to-date version. The following links are provided for Interagency Fire Professionals who are tasked with administering contracts issued by our Unit and is provided solely for that purpose and intent. 6-month Exclusive Use (EU) contract extensions for 34 - Type 2 helicopters with contracts expiring in 2022, utilizing BOAs for remaining EU line items. National Type 1 and 2 CWN Contract: GPS Visualizer - Convert Coordinates. Light Operational Loads Monitoring Systems (OLMS) The banker looks at your household income and job stability. For aircraft in the first two categories, fire-fighting equipment consists of efficient and versatile ventral kits . Other candidates would be the 412, and the other twin engine mediums on the market from AW and Airbus/Eurocopter. Maybe in talking to a 3rd party lender the FS would learn more about these challenges that industry is facing due to the well intended, but poorly delivered solicitation requirements? Scurit civile: the Dragons in the early hours of Rostec signed dealership agreements on supplying VRT500 Mi-38: successful test in extreme conditions, Wiking Helikopter Service adds an H145 to its fleet. Personnel and Equipment: 219 total personnel; 2 helicopters, 14 Type-6 engines, 13 Type-2 tractor plow units, 1 drone, . They can transport up to nine firefighters at one time. Forest Service CWN Medium/Heavy Helicopters Fire Suppression Orders 11/1/2021 Through 10/31/2022 DOI OC Small Type III Helicopter - National Park Service Search and Rescue (SAR) (2022) For Alaska/Hawaii Emergency/Fire/SAR task order numbers, please contact Heather Sizick, Lead Contracting Office at 571-479-0323 or Rebecca Fentzke, Division . Bill is pandering to advertisers and we here at FS have so much knowledge we cant be wrong. Your last sentence in the nail in the coffin.seeing as that this contract will be LPTA and a year to year option, how do you finance a new a/c that will surely be $2-$4M on the low end? We dont fly in 58Ts (which I saw on exclusive use contract as an unrestricted as late at 2006) Llamas, etc. Type 1 helicopters are the largest, fastest flying and the most expensive helicopters used on wildland fires. Topping the list is Tennessee, with New Jersey and Hawaii close behind in second and third. When the helicopter is in position, the crew releases the water to extinguish hot spots. The FS doesnt seem to trust the input from the industry on this, so maybe the FS should ask the people who provide the mortgage? Aircraft types: P2V, HC-130H, BAe-146, MD-87, C-130Q, RJ85, C-130 H & J equipped with Modular Airborne Fire Fighting Systems (MAFFS). Financing a new (2000+) aircraft with a one year contract will be the nail in the coffin for most operators considering what they have to sell will get pennies on the dollar. Maybe all of the experienced aviation folks you mention are part of this have never actually had to buy a multi-million a/c, maintain it, crew it and ensure that its operable? Aviation Management, USDA Melinda Draper, Associate Branch Chief, Logistics, Very Large Airtankers (VLAT)are capable of delivering over 8,000 gallons of fire retardant to support firefighters on the ground. National Pilots %PDF-1.6 % Columbia has been focusing a lot of their efforts to Afghanistan and other overseas over the last decade. Does a 407 not meet the new requirements? endstream endobj 11 0 obj <> endobj 12 0 obj <> endobj 13 0 obj <> endobj 14 0 obj <>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text]/ExtGState<>>> endobj 15 0 obj <> endobj 16 0 obj <> endobj 17 0 obj <>stream %%EOF There are only 2 options and they are well in to the 10s of millions of dollars. Wont the guaranteed hours for a contract be a exclusive use. Once we get all of that figured out, turns out that the increase in performance specifications at 7,000 / 30C combined with the added equipment pretty much eliminates legacy ships from meeting performance requirements. Some helitack crews are trained to rappel from helicopters to fires in remote locations. Thank you. Bill has been at this for a long time and has always been a fair arbiter of the facts. The question and answer document shows the USFS is unwilling to be understanding its our way or the highway, thanks for nothing. Forest fire contracts are also an economic windfall for operators and manufacturers, yet they are a tiny portion of the $ 3 billion that the fight against forest fires cost in 2017! If as you suggest they can choose to not submit a proposal then two things are going to happen: 1) that aircraft will not be part of the AFF fleet next year and 2) you will have less a/c in the future b/c of it. Anyone who served in the military knows that Uncle Sam Air is the most inefficient airline in the world, and having worked there is in no way a guarantee that you are the best subject matter expert on anything. There is no cost, and in case you change your mind each email has an unsubscribe button. Those who can manage might do fineor they might just get tossed out with the bathwater.. These helicopters are the largest that are used for fighting wildfires and can carry between 700 and 3,000 gallons of water or fire retardant. Typos or errors, report them HERE. Aviation for Regions 3,4,6,8 National Interagency Aviation Committee Publication Library, BLM Access to the U.S. Forest Service Contracting, Incident Support Branch, DOI SharePoint Page must be granted individually. The table below shows NWCG minimum performance requirements for water tenders. NIFC is home to the national fire management programs of each federal fire agency, along with partners including the National Association of State Foresters, the U.S. Fire Administration, and the National Weather Service. Aircraft Engineering Services Nope. The only modern type III helicopter we can find that meets the requirement is $6.4m which is triple the value of our 5 type III helicopter fleet (and we own a Type III light twin, its just too old for the Forest Services liking). Southern Area Coordination Center Operating Plan. Branch: Air . Helicopters were first used on wildfires in 1947. Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the . Columbia sold to another company last year and with the combined ammount of aircraft they are considered a large company. Then why are one year contracts with optional years considered a sustainable way for helicopter companies to provide helicopters for fire fighting? The Chinooks were mainly operated with a Bambi Bucket but three companies, Helimax, Columbia Helicopters and Billings, now use internal bunkers developed by subcontractors, including Simplex, a well-known manufacturer of HBE kits, which allows these aircraft to have a higher intervention speed while taking up to 12,000 liters of water internally. AMS Billee Codes. AMD-23E Instructions for USFS National Type 1 & 2 Call When Needed (CWN) Contract Helicopters hired for DOI Incidents. National Interagency Fire Center AMS Mission Codes. A .gov website belongs to an official government organization in the United States. Just need to add, Mama told me the customer is always right. TheNWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typingis jointly developed and maintained bythe following National Wildfire Coordinating Group (NWCG) committees and their subgroups: While they may contain current or useful information, previous versions are obsolete. agency that, more and more, is becoming its own worst enemy, as well as ours! Although Type 3 helicopters are smaller, they have a higher cruise speed than a typical Type 2 helicopter and can arrive on the scene of an initial attack wildfire faster. If the income is lower and lower due to LPTA and the job security is year to year with no guarantee, most lenders will tell you to try another house to mortgage your house. It seems nothing is making sense anymore, and we are destined to fail if this shortsightedness is allowed to continue. AMS - Aviation Management System (AMD-23E), AMD-23E Instructions for USFS National Type 1 & 2 Call When Needed (CWN) Contract Helicopters hired for DOI Incidents, BLM Annual Helitack Data Master (January 2017), BLM Exclusive Use Fire Helicopter Crew Training and Experience Requirements, 14 CFR Federal Aviation Regulations (FAR), National Transportation Safety Board Information, Toggle Dyslexia-friendly black-on-creme color scheme, Aerial wildland fire training taking place this week at Channel Islands Air National Guard Station, Military aircraft equipped with MAFFS mobilized to assist with wildfire suppression efforts, First Annual National Wildland Firefighter Day Announced, BLM and Maverik Partner to Reduce Human-Caused Wildfires, Aerial wildland fire training taking place in Boise april 25-29, Andrus Center for Public Policy and Partners Seek National Student Congress Address Wildland Fire Management, National Interagency Incident Communications Division, National Incident Management Organization. Without a federal contract, we cant get carded and without cards, we cant work for the state. National Call-When-NeededHelicopters (Large Fire Support/Initial Attack)Flight Rate Charts Effective February 16, 2021for contracts awarded 2013-2017Flight Rate Charts Effective February 16, 2021 for contracts awarded 2018-2021Region 5 Aviation For an operator to be competitive in the LPTA world, you need to amortize the cost of the a/c over 10 years or more. 5121, et seq., for ownership and operation of equipment, including depreciation, overhead, all maintenance, field repairs, fuel, lubricants, tires, OSHA equipment and other costs incidental to operation. This draft RFP is such a massive and violent change from what has been requested in previous contracts that most operators arent going to be able to handle it. =Wd{,,}[bx`3j2Fyyn y } These aircraft are classified in three categories, depending on their capabilities, categories that also determine the value of the contracts. I find it interesting that the WFT crowd is pro a next gen, advanced air tanker fleet (including the funding required) but is up in arms about a next gen, advanced helicopter fleet. @RtS1yD &LS,60E0U22U0J7gm:b|gY. Large, heavy-lift helicopters can fill their water tanks with a snorkel that siphons water from lakes, rivers, or other sources. And they are cheap azzs that wont pay much for anything. Smokejumper STC Like I have mentioned before at the Fed level, too much too late. Apart from a few military helicopters mobilized occasionally and only as reinforcement, most of the air assets used to fight fires in the US are the work of countless more or less specialized aerial work companies, who each have very varied means. PRINT NWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typing, PMS 200, NWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typing, PMS 200, M-581, Fire Program Management Course Steering Committee, M-582, AA Advanced Wildland Fire Course Steering Committee, Committee Roles and Membership Information, Course Steering Committee Guidance & Templates, International Association of Fire Chiefs Roster, National Association of State Foresters Roster, Alternative Pathways to NWCG Qualification, Incident Performance Training Modernization (IPTM), Wildland Fire Leadership Development Program, NWCG Data Standard: Fire Resource Kind, Category, and Type, Incident and Position StandardsCommittee, Standards forInteragency Hotshot Crew Operations, Retardant or water-carrying capability (gal), Maximum gross takeoff and landing weight (lb). I may be incorrect in this, but I think the less than excited response from industry is based on them providing questions and input to the PM, HS and CO and getting pretty unsatisfactory responses. Region 6 Cache Freight Services %%EOF These were but up for bid to have extra fully staffed helicopters ready to respond due to the virus. Rotating blades are also present and again play a discrete but essential role where their natural qualities are exploited at best. Steve Peterson, Contracting Officer Given the current climate of helicopter contracts there will be more people getting out of helicopters than getting into them. The USFS did not get the number of LATs they assumed they would, I know it shocked them. Bill would rather not take his private industry advertisers $$$, but he should and needs to get paid for the hard work he puts in and he knows you Government boys cant/wont pay him to tell the truth. fleet is composed of primarily contractor-owned and operated aircraft but the Forest Service does own numerous helicopters and fixed wing aircraft. The A-10 is built to be highly survivable and can takeoff and land in locations near the front lines. The single vs twin vs safety argument doesnt have a clear winner unless youre talking about CAT A capable aircraft. Courtesy Photo/USFS. Must be annually certified by the local host unit agency administrator or designee prior to being made available for assignment. Helicopters were first used on wildfires in 1947. four user categories rates: Other DoD, Other Federal, Foreign Military Sales, and All Other. Comments, questions, and recommendations shall be submitted to the appropriate agency representative assigned to the steward for each resource. These helicopters can strategically drop thousands of gallons of water or retardant with pinpoint accuracy, while working closely with ground personnel and other firefighting aircraft. USFS R8 / USFWS R4 Annual Operating Plan for the use of the AS350B2 Helicopter. United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) Forest Service (FS) Secure .gov websites use HTTPS Sucks that theyre limiting their choices on the RFP. For example they get 4 hours of flight pay whether they fly 0 or 3.8. There are still going to be normal cwn helicopters. Office: (208) 387-5279 Mobile: (208) 608-6763, Helicopters have a tank of flammable product and a flare and are used to burn down wooded areas in prescribed burning and fire areas. The blackhawk will not replace the 212 because it cant, and a regular category S-70 would have to bid three or four times the price of a 212 to make financial sense even if you could get a 4 year EU contract. TheNWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typingestablishes minimum typing standards for aircraft, crews, and equipment for national mobilization to wildland fire incidents. Besides the cost for the new equipment will be passed on the FS through the increase in Daily Availability rates. Center *Manufacturers published rated net horsepower (HP). ALSE Handbook/Guide Ver 2.8 November 25, 2017 2 . Forest Service Fire and Aviation Qualifications Guide (FSFAQG) Federal Wildland Fire Qualifications Supplement. Designed by Elegant Themes | Powered by WordPress, Guide to customs clearance for a Helvetian aircraft, Bell unveils industrialists on the Invictus program. Call-When-Needed (CWN) Airtankers 2.1 startxref 0000007535 00000 n 0 The Blackhawk wont work because they are restricted category. Do you know anything that can replace the current platforms? No. Smokejumper Aircraft Through the use of Preseason Agreements and by partnering with the U.S. Forest Service Region 6 Fire Aviation Contracting Team (FACT), through VIPR contracts, DNR is able to pull in outside resources quickly if needed. I may be incorrect in this, but I think the less than excited response from industry is based on them providing questions and input to the PM, HS and CO and getting pretty unsatisfactory responses. Basic Ordering Agreements (BOAs) for 28 - Type 1 helicopters having 120-day mandatory availability periods. Yes, the customer is the FS. 0000008566 00000 n They are versatile fire management tools. The banker looks at your household income and job stability. Give me a break. DAY OFF DAILY AV RATE HRLY FT RATE (DRY) 150Hrs/Over 150 Hrs DAILY OPTIONAL POST AV RATE CONTRACTING OFFICER 1. Initial attack, fireline construction, firing as directed. 43 aircraft are under exclusive contract with the USFS in 2018. If we have an aircraft on the market that give us a better margin of safety in the high and hot environment the USFS works in why wouldnt we pursue it other than money? We operate Type III helicopters and are now faced with 40lbs+ of equipment (costing over $60k per aircraft) to meet minimum requirements - things that we really don't need like a Traffic Avoidance System (but the ADS-B they required last year isn't good enough) and a loudspeaker (because yelling at the fire helps? Aerial Supervision Module (ASM) Lead Planes Exactly. The arrogance and dismissal by the FS with most questions being answered Noted, Language will remain as written just adds frustration to irritation. Furthermore the numbers they provide are usually . The companies willing to make adjustments will do just that and end up with contracts.
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